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Interviewee

Mary (Shannon) Thomas

Place Recorded

Coffs Harbour-NSW

Interviewer

Sheridah Melvin

Collection

Agency

Yarrila Arts & Museum (YAM)

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Mary Thomas Interview

Details

IntervieweeMary (Shannon) ThomasInterview Date18 August 198627 August 198630 January 1987Place RecordedCoffs Harbour-NSWDuration2h39m13sAccession NumberLS2020.1.38Credit LineCoffs Harbour City Council, 1988.

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Description

Mrs Thomas is a local authority on the history of the area. She was interviewed three times on three different dates; the interviews have been merged into one. They appear in the following order:

1. Personal life story (the third interview, dated 30 January 1987)

2. Schools (the first interview, dated 18 August 1986)

3. Railway (the second interview, dated 27 August 1986)

InterviewerSheridah MelvinCollectionYAM Museum CollectionVoice of Time oral history projectAgencyYarrila Arts & Museum (YAM)SummaryStandard disclaimer. Visit the 'Voice of Time' web site to read or listen to the disclaimer. Family background; the station at Grenfell. Her father, Moses Shannon and the drought of 1902-1906. The Bank took back the station -- The move to Wellington, NSW, where Mary was born in 1906 -- The death of Mr Shannon and remarriage to Albert McDonald, a wheelwright and blacksmith -- The origin of Mary's middle name, Pythiah -- News of the work on the North Coast railway line reached Wellington. The McDonald family prepared to travel to Coffs Harbour -- Mary was approximately five when they left. She rode a horse all the way behind the sulky -- They arrived on Christmas Eve, 1909. Mr Schwinghammer advised the family to stay at McGurran's Coffee Palace and directed them to the railway depot at the Jetty -- They stayed there for three months, after which her parents bought the mill house of BAT timber mill at the Jetty for five pounds -- Details of the McGurran family. Aunt Rose was the maternity nurse -- Mary, from the age of seven, was driving Nurse McGurran about in a sulky as she visited various expectant mothers. Mary's mother had strong opinions about education, "get your basics and the world will educate you". Mary had great freedom - only attending school two days per week -- She received tuition of a high standard at home. "She could measure my intelligence and knowledge by the kids that were going to school every day" -- "I wanted to see the country" -- Mr McDonald was the highest paid man at Norton and Griffith (the railway contractors); receiving 3 pounds, 16 shillings and 4 pence per week. Mr McDonald was an extremely good manager -- The terms of his contract, his assistants and the type of work done -- The forge described -- The young nippers on the railway line. Mrs McDonald's working day as a housewife at the Jetty. The Metters oven -- The camp ovens -- "We were outgoing", the neighbours and the house itself -- The cow from Bonville - every calf was a heifer. Buckets of milk. The chook-pen. "A barter system existed, we didn't need money ... a penny was big money" -- Childhood impressions of Jetty life. Mary's lifestyle was made possible by her mother's attitudes to her clothes, hair and appreciation of her love of horseriding -- The Bush Nursing Hospital at the Jetty -- The beach and Mary's first impression of the sea -- Anderton's Store; Tom Colvin's shop. Waterfront life; Mr Brodie and Mr Shea. Cargoes described. The wagonettes -- The springcarts of pigs driven to the Jetty -- Jetty families -- "There seemed to be more boys than girls ... that suited me". The games they played were generally marbles and tops -- The landscape as it was when Mary rode through it -- The popularity of fishing was universal as it supplemented their food. "The saddest moment of my life was when the Convent School opened in 1913" -- Before this, Mary had attended the Misses Banks' canvas school at the Jetty -- "It was a novelty to walk" -- "Nothing cramped my style - I just decided I wasn't going" -- Mary retained her initiative towards schoolwork. The history of her mother's education -- "She'd say 'seven sevens' or 'five twos' in between the same time as you'd have a piece of bread and jam" -- Her first impression of the Convent School. The nuns and the priest visited homes. Their concern for Mary's education. The Jetty fire of 1914, how it started -- "It went right up to the Pier Hotel and burnt them out". The rebuilding of the Hotel -- The importance of the Pier as a social centre. The BAT mill fire in the same year -- Mrs McDonald's decision to buy the blacksmith's shop at Coramba in order to follow the railway line work. Mary's involvement in the work of the shop in 1915. She attended Coramba Public School. "He taught us bugger all" -- Mary's two years here were not wasted as she always had home tuition -- The return to town at Orange Trees -- Mary's stepfather built her a small blacksmith's shop there to do shoeing for the neighbours. The jam tin was her till. She was about twelve -- Contents of the shop; miniature anvil and bellows -- 'Hot-shod' horses paid 4 shillings and 6 pence. A 'Slipper' was a thrown shoe and cost 2 shillings -- She was horsebreaking at twelve years and it cost thirty shillings per horse. "They'd bring them in to my place, I'd have the horse for a fortnight" -- "School dovetailed between that, a couple of days a week ... I'd catch the children coming home from school ... I'd keep up with them because I had the knowhow" -- The cattle keeping on Red Hill before the railway went through. Sales of animals to Arthur Fogarty, the butcher -- Mr McDonald's tent at Nana Glen. Mary picked him up on weekends in a sulky -- "Few people were sick" -- The pig on a chain, Black Bess, her pet. Mary's money management and household economy. "It was just there the same as you'd use the soap in the bathroom" -- Mary's mother did not believe in banks. The family structure - the absence of a boss -- The horse-teamsters from Dorrigo. Mary's business arrangements with them. Chaff and corn bags -- While checking the stock on Red Hill, Mary collected medicine bottles for Finch the Chemist -- The character of the teamsters. The safety of those days compared to now -- "God help the little nipper who swore in front of a lady". The models in Mary's life. "I wanted to be an engineer" -- Distress at leaving school -- Spiritual values - "Time is the stuff life is made of" -- Business principles after school -- The errand for the nuns led to Mary sitting for the Postal Institute entrance exam -- "I went into the Post Office on the 26th September 1921" -- Further promotion. Actual duties at work. The Sydney headquarters decided to send Mary to psychology classes at Sydney University -- The Trouble Board and learning to deal with people. The extent of telephone services in Coffs Harbour in 1921. "A little hundred board with 63-64 connections" -- Increased connections in those two years; a new 200 board and a little trunk board -- The cost of having the phone put on was thirty shillings -- The uniqueness of a manual exchange. Mary's feelings about her job -- Dealing with accidents, fires and floods -- The bluff at Glenreagh. The use of the 'galvo' to test the line -- The exchanges as information centres. The strong sense of community -- An example of contacting an otherwise unavailable person. Her first impression of Sydney University in 1926 -- The thinking behind giving psychology training. "If you're busting your guts to fix them up and you don't give them that feeling, they'd be complaining" -- The course was rudimentary, specially created for employees of the Postal Institute -- The return to Coffs in 1928 -- Marriage and childbirth in Queensland and Coffs. Her RH Factor was a serious complication -- The Sister in charge of Sunnyside Hospital was Ann McLeod. The baby had a golden glow due to jaundice -- Doctor Yarad and his attitude to poorer people -- Mary's husband was a bookmaker -- Life at Park Beach -- Mary's carpentry skills and also plumbing were learned at the Orange Trees period under the supervision of Bob Shephard. Plumbing also. Income from renting -- The return to Coffs during wartime. The Park Beach Progress Association -- The bad conditions of Park Beach in the 1940s -- Mary's feelings during the War. The army at Park Beach -- Her interest in motor mechanics -- The torpedoing of the hospital ship and the survivors at the high school. -- Enjoyment of motherhood and household. Her luck in having a husband who said "Whatever your mother does is right". Mary's love of writing -- Her opinion of childrearing, "I look on people as plants". Pure foods -- The childhood values of her generation -- The lack of giving a good example to children today -- Manners and etiquette. Her own grandson -- The value of honesty. "Even our politicians". The grave errors in children's early introduction to sex. The separation of human sexuality from other natural processes -- "The mind is absorbed with sex - the mind governs the body" -- The premature growth of secondary sexual characteristics -- "There's money in it - the pill and the condoms" -- "Little children are being denied childhood". Personality Portrait - a cameo account of local identities recalled by Mrs Thomas, (1) P.J. McNamara, the auctioneer -- "He was the first to start tourist activities". Lip to lip advertising for Coffs Harbour -- He was very correct in his dealings with people, never speaking about people's business -- The fire at the Advocate office destroyed valuable, historical records -- (2) W.E. Mann, the publican of the Pier Hotel -- The thousands of navvies patronised the Hotel -- "Talk about PR they don't know anything about it today". The arrangement with P.J. McNamara. (3) Louie Lacrosse -- Aboriginal people in Coffs -- Wild cherries were medicine -- Permanent camps along the Orara River. Standard disclaimer. Visit the 'Voice of Time' web site to read or listen to the disclaimer. The number of schools that have arisen in Coffs since 1880s -- The schools described in detail, starting with the Slab School -- 1910, The Misses Banks' School -- Carrie Walsh's School -- 1913, the Convent School -- The head nun and main teacher of this Convent was an MA. Her name was Sister Vergilius -- "Coffs Harbour was lucky to have that standard" -- Coffs Harbour High School in 1938 -- Detailed account of Misses Banks' School -- The school catered for the children of the Navvies to a great extent. They taught music and social graces, and held concerts -- Manners were taught at the Convent School on Friday afternoons -- "You command the respect that you gave" was the motto -- Account of lessons -- The Nun's arrival was an opportunity for all, not only Catholics -- The community support for the nuns -- Shorthand, typewriting and bookkeeping after school -- Description of a lesson -- They were taught Algebra, Greek and Latin. They all had a dictionary -- People unable to pay for schooling sent "goods in kind". The actual church building was used as the school -- By 1919, Mickie and Denny Griffin had completed the new building -- Other money-raising activities -- The funds paid for the Nuns' annual holidays in Glebe -- A comparison with schooling today -- "Poetry was an important subject" -- Fourteen years was the official age to leave school -- The QC. The parents of Coffs were brought together in the development of schooling -- Public Service jobs were becoming available from 1920 -- Teachers and principals were respected greatly -- There was a sense of snobbery in socialising with teachers -- Children did miss out on opportunities by not being able to travel to high school -- The importance of learning a trade -- Coffs boys who did their QC. The importance of the teacher's relationship with parents -- The Karangi School produced outstanding students -- The Bursary system -- Nippy Ward from Coramba School -- Mrs Thomas' own home tuition was important. The key figures in Coffs who pushed for better education facilities -- The Coffs Harbour Chamber of Commerce "was the corner stone" -- P.J. Macnamara went to Sydney in person to lobby -- Mrs Thomas' opinion on the present needs of students -- Her opinion on the amount of school time being given to sport -- The role of multinationals in this. In 1910, Norton and Griffith had the tender to build the section of line -- The Jetty area was the focal point for the beginning of work -- The Shipping Company provided a colossal goods shed -- In Orlando Street, the Misses McGurran provided accommodation and meals -- While construction preparations progressed, Mary rode her horse around the town. She was five -- In 1912 the commercial carpenters had finished their work. P.J. Macnamara chaired the first meeting of the Chamber of Commerce in 1911 -- The population was about to rise with the arrival of 200 horses bringing families of the Navvies from Telegraph Point -- Blacksmith Albert McDonald and assistants made large numbers of shoes in readiness for the horses -- Traders and farmers awaited the patronage -- Mrs Best's Boarding House raised its status to that of a Coffee Palace -- The arrival of the horses -- Overnight erection of tents -- "A disturbed ant bed" -- Description of the Nipper's job -- The Gangers' eating-houses -- Board was fifteen shillings a week; the code was to board at the Ganger's wife's house -- Construction was from Coffs Harbour towards Repton -- The railway station at Coffs was finished by 1915 -- Gangers had a status equal to that of the Shire President -- Wages were 2 pounds 10 shillings a week -- The effect of the cash on local shops -- Typical purchases -- Household management among the Navvies -- "Bread and dripping hops" -- "They took over the Pier Hall" at the Jetty -- Pubs opened until 11pm -- "They certainly were a drinking mob". Swearing styles -- W.E. Mann provided hospitality for many VIPs at his Pier Hotel. The land boom in 1915 -- The hill near Orlando Street was reserved for meat works -- The Navvies' recreations included two-up, horse racing and foot races -- A description of two-up coins -- "The police didn't interfere" -- Account of the Navvies' wives' lives. Accidents during construction -- Bush Nursing Association erected a tent hospital -- "The Navvies decided to make application" for a proper hospital -- They contributed 3 pence a week towards a building fund -- Mr Marsh went door to door collecting on Mondays -- Billy Mann's Fighting Stadium -- George Holloway, a typesetter at The Advocate, started the first gas light flicks. It was a penny to get in. The construction moved on out to Red Hill. The tunnels. Norton and Griffith had underestimated the cost of the tunnels. P.J. Macnamara went by ship to Sydney to lobby the Government to take over. The tent city at Red Hill. Coffs shopkeepers organised car service shopping. Perry's wagonette. Saturday night in town, the traditions. "They'd call them The Clique". How Mary came to see the Red Hill people so frequently -- Her contact with the women -- The span of years was 1916 to 1918 -- Dynamite blasting struck water -- Fatality for a powder monkey -- Description of blasting. Red Hill and the social conditions -- The changing workforce. The fighting at Glenreagh. "Blood all down their shirts" -- The first ever train in 1923.